help please, cup steering

[Stew]

Hello all, hope all is well,
im really hopeful someone may be able to help here! .

My 197 cup fqiled its mot late last week, a known abs fault, binding rear brakes, and this;

Excessive play in the "track rod end balljoints" on both sides.
Ive had the car 4 years now and ive always had a slight knock in the steering when parking up, which in hot weather turns into an awful squeel,
so im thinking good this will finally be the answer, looking on the brightside becaise I really just want it to be right at last!!!!

i use a good place local to us, motorsport experienced which is very reassuring.
Sadly they (I didnt know this) have to farm remedial work out to a chap about 4 doors down which I thought fair enough if you say hes good and its on the doorstep too handy for the re test .

ive now got the car back and the chap did say to me on the phone that there is now quite alot of noise "from the rack area"

i did ask him to fit me my track focus direct steering rack bush
which ive had in the glovebox for 4 years! (to me this was surely my nailed on solution to any rack woes).

The steering now feels a touch heavier which I assume is a good thing (down to the new track rod ends?) but immediately as I drove 4 doors to the mot place for a re test it sounded awful, squeeling and clunking really, I know the weather is hot at the moment, I think it was approx 28 degrees at this point.
i spent alot of money and just wanted it to finally be right, I was half expecting the mot teater to fail it again.
It passed bit we had a convo and he said something wasnt right even thoigh there was no play to be found now.
He did say that due to the lower engine cover he couldnt see the rack etc...
I explained that id had the track focus direct steering rack bush fitted and he thought may be it was the actual rack now.

pleased with the pass but the drive home was dreadful, squeeling and a slight clunk, the squeeling getting progresively worse the longer the drive home became.
I was really gutted lastnight, tried not to be down. I went to work this morning early doors, not a murmur from the car, no squeel no clunking, ok this is positive! fingers crossed.
I drive home and I can now sense the tracking is definitely out (argggh I hate that) really anmoyed now as the motorsport place had it spot on prior to this point.
Then the ladt turn home and the squeeling started again (25 min journey) absolutely hacked off again now !!!! what the!?

so, I know its pretty hard to be certain but do people think it could be the rack itself?
i kind of wish I hadnt fitted the track focus direct bush now,
or could it be something else?

there ses to be various terms to describe the (same?) part, ball joints, swivel hubs? but the motorsport man didnt mention ball joints, just the track rod end (different right?)
im just not sure what it is, but the tracking is really annoying me and is making the driving experience worse now.
I know this has probably been covered before on here, bit I would really appreciate any help
oddly my non working washer pump seems like its working now at least, how weird.

best wishes,

S

 

[Stew]

apologies for the spelling above, my phone screen is cracked in several places and I can barely see!!!

 

[link]

The suspension is quite complex; there's a top and bottom ball joint (swivel joints) that join the hub to the carrier, the wishbone has a ball joint too, there's two anti-rotation arms, inner track rods and the track rod ends.


So lots to go wrong!

Common failures are lower ball joints, inner track rods and track rod ends. As for the squeeling does it sound metallic?

Some of the more stupid things that can happen... there's a metal bush that can come out of the aluminum hub with the old rod end, if they don't swap it over to the new one it has no taper to tighten into and causes a lot of wobbling, also the track rod ends are left and right handed so two different part numbers!

 

[Stew]

brilliant help thanl you v much indeed, im thinking along the lines of "some of the more stupid things" now...

the squeel occurs at just a feqction off centre of the steering wheel, it seems to increase during the journey (heating up?) I dont know, im thinking all sorts of negative things but would like to finally get it sorted if I can as its really getting to me.
I may have to go to a real specialist with it and not one of these general type garages I think, birchdown if I can maybe.

thanks again for your help mate

S

 

[Stew]

hi all hope all is well, little update on my creaking clio!

ive been to a very well respected garage today for a 4 wheel alignment as its driving dreadfully after the so called tracking was carried out.

It turns out that when the work was done with the track rod ends, they didnt refit the sleeve and there is a fair bit of play on the drivers side as a result. Ive had the wheels aligned to improve the woeful feel, although it isnt fully correct its much better for now until I can finally get the track rod sorted.
So I was hoping I might be able to buy a sleeve from somewhere??
please does anynody know where I may find one?
any help is greatly appreciated as ever,
many thanks
stew

 

[Sean197]

hi all hope all is well, little update on my creaking clio!

ive been to a very well respected garage today for a 4 wheel alignment as its driving dreadfully after the so called tracking was carried out.

It turns out that when the work was done with the track rod ends, they didnt refit the sleeve and there is a fair bit of play on the drivers side as a result. Ive had the wheels aligned to improve the woeful feel, although it isnt fully correct its much better for now until I can finally get the track rod sorted.
So I was hoping I might be able to buy a sleeve from somewhere??
please does anynody know where I may find one?
any help is greatly appreciated as ever,
many thanks
stew

renault clio sport 197 track rod end bush new | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for renault clio sport 197 track rod end bush new at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[Stew]

fantastic many thank for your help! i was talking to the garage owner this afternoon qmd he thought they were pretty hard to get hold of (sleeves) my first port of call was to ask on here sorry I should have done some searching
I was going to ask the garage who did the work if theyve still got the old sleeve.
thanks again
stew

 

[S24nrc]

You're best to keep your mileage to a minimum without them sleeves present, you could potentially wear the swivel hubs casting and introduce some lovely issues off the back of that.

 

[Stew]

yes exactly what I was thinking, thanks mate its going on on monday to be looked at now chers
stew

 

[Stew]

cheers even *

 

[Stew]

Hi all hope all is ok.
I have an update on my clios steering situation.
I took it to Drury Lane auto services in Oldham as id heard nothing but good things about their wheel alignment services.
I left it wth them having explained everything about the mot and the remedial work it needed, track rod ends on both sides, new rear discs and pads, clearing the abs fault code etc..
Upon my return it was explained that the place i used had it seemed forgotten to fit the hub sleeve to the drivers side as therr was a sbocking amount of play on the drivers side front wheel.

I ended up ringing the garage andasked if they could take a look: agreed and they were honest to.admit it was their error, they ordered me a sleeve from the link in this theead (thans again) and fitted it for free.
I then had to go back to Oldham, to drury lane to have the wheel alignment done.
Weirdlyi was still experiencing some creaking from the drivers side despite having tje missing sleeve fitted, but after the re alignment of the wheels it stopped!
im happy at this point and the car is a joy to drive if im honest.
2 weeks ago i noticed a bloody annoying squeak from the rear brakes whilst driving, great....
I could smell burning and was sure i had a sticking caliper. I rang the place who did the remedial work for the mpt again and asked to be booked in as i thought i needed a rear caliper, im not after a freebie im wanting to pay for a new caliper theres no hint of me blaming anyone, ive now got light rubning marks on the new rear disc and im eager to stop the squeak!

I stopped using the clio and used my wifes old car for daily duties
I took the car to the garage and they rang me to say good news it doesnt need a new caliper or a disc or even a pad, it was just a stone that had got stuck which was causing the problem! they explained that they took the brakes apart and used an airline to blow any further dirt away, im now thinking this is a result, 40 quid.
Ive now got the car back and now there is a definite problem with the steering, its heavy (ive slept on this knowing it cod be due to me using a different car for nigh on a week) but its definitely different to how it was prior to tje brake work When i turn right at junctions and sweeping bends the steefing wheel isnt now returning properly as you naturally straighten up as you complete your turn, and it just feels as though theres an issue on the drivers side of the car, theres no evidence of a sticky brake though but it feels like there is? and tonight ive turned a fairly tight left hand junction and it just isnt flowing as it should, quite a pronounced reluctance to straighten up in the steering, you have to do it for yourself which results in a wobble as it feels like its snatching slightly.
I absolutely love this car bit it seems that since the mot and alot of money later i cant get it to drive properly. Is it at all.possible that something in the rear brake (drivers side) has been disturbed and is causing the steering problem? i hope its just a simple fix.
But in short, if you are near Manchester i can really recommend Drury lane garage to you if you need any alignment work doing.
Thanks for any further help or suggestions and for reading,
cheers

stew

 

[Stew]

apologies for the typos! my phone screen is cracked and i cant find the edit function!

 

[RSRowe]

Sounds like you have a duff lower swivel. This will exhibit stiff steering and the noises you describe.
Unfortunately you’re likely in for a bit of a pricey fix on that one - especially if you decide to replace both lowers, both uppers, and the ball joints (which is what I’d do).

The garage leaving the sleeve out of the track rod happens all too often. You’re very lucky that you’ve not knackered the hub by continuing to drive it.

 

[Stew]

thanks for your reply
i cant understand how it was all ok until i had the rear drivers side brake looked at?
it was literally spot on and now its not. It wasnt making any noises apart from the squeak from the rear brake and was driving excellent after the sleeve was fitted and i had the aignment done, no w im in this mess over a stone!?
we are currently gett9ng properly rinsed over our eldest sons car insurance and the clio is now worrying me financially too.
Its a great car andim really gutted now.
thanks
stew

 

[RSRowe]

Unless I've misread, it looks like it's been an issue from the outset and completely unrelated to your brake issues.

I always say the same, but you really need to find a garage who work on these cars day in day out. You'll be charged a fortune at a 'regular' garage as they'll no doubt want to replace the whole hub assembly. It needs diagnosing properly too - as opposed to just us internet people taking vest guesses.

 

[Stew]

Hi again and thanks for your help as ever.
In conclusion i think you are right, its always been an issue bit im wondering why the swivel hub (ball joint right?) wasnt picked up at the mot? i dont think there is any play in it as the guy at drury lane garage would definitely have found it when he did my 2nd wheel alignment session.
When the ball joint is described as being 'seized' thus making the steering feel heavy i assume they are suposed to rotate in the hub?
i did actually need to replace tje whole hub on the nearside last year as i was told one of the mounting holes had become ovalised.
So to the ball joint job! is there a cheap way of doing this please?
i totally agreee about the need to go to a renaultsport expert for it im just really hoping it can be done for a sensible price, does anyone know anybody please in Manchester ? i know about birchdown just wondering if theres any other gurus lurking around? i seem to think theres a place in wigan too?
many thanks again,
stew

 

[Stew]

and tonight my rear brake squeak has returned!!!

 

[link]

You mentioned in this post getting the n/s hub replaced so it's probably the o/s that's seized. You can replace the ball joints on thir own but it's a tricky job and if they crack the aluminium hub your f*cked so probably better off just buying a new hub complete.

You also mentioned in this post the ABS sensor brackets needed replacing, did you get this done as that can cause squeeking?

Rear calipers sticking is a common problem with these, new caliper or a rebuild will sort it for a "while"... other causes can be hand brake cables sticking.

 

[Stew]

Hiya mate and big thanks for replying.
Yes i did have a new nearside complete hub fitted so im also thinking its the time to replace the offside yes.
Re; the abs rings yes i had brand new discs fitted which come with new rings (?) i supplied a pair of genuine abs holders too but they didnt use them!!!
i think ill see if i an get the caliper refurbished maybe, ironically i saw a caliper refurb van go passed me on the motorway last week and it said "we come to you" but i cant find them now on the web! .
im feeling a bit more positive about getting this car driving correctly finally now!
many thanks again,
stew

 

[link]

"i supplied a pair of genuine abs holders too but they didnt use them!!!"

This is your problem, get them changed ASAP before you damage the ABS sensors or the sensor rings!