Can the clio be replaced?

[BenW]

Some of you will know, I've been thinking about selling up and moving on. Real motivation is that the 197 isn't an ideal everyday car, I'm a bit tired of it on the commute and I really fancy some more power. I was pretty much set on an e46 M3 as they're great cars, had a good test drive yesterday on some windy roads and dual carriageways... impressive car. Very fast and pushes you back in the seat but in reality doesn't feel a massive amount faster than the 197 on the road, and doesn't handle as well.

However, going out for one of the last 'blasts' this afternoon with all the mods still on the car (KW V3s, akrapovic etc.) I'm really wondering if I'm doing the right thing. The clio is just sooo much fun on the right roads, the handling is sublime and only made better by the KWs, the noise from the akra fantastic at full chat and when you're finished having fun you can cruise home. To top this off, when talking about trade in on the 197 yesterday the salesman said he really loved the 197s and said they're phenomenally fast in the bends on track..... all just makes me wonder what I really want in a car and I think I ultimately want fun. Is there anything out there at a sensible price that can give the same thrills?

So, the way I see it I have a few options:
1) Carry on selling up and buying an M3 (Sell clio + ~£6000 to get a good one)
2) Keep the clio and buy a second car (Economical diesel focus or similar ~£5000) but don't really have the space for 2 cars
3) Stop worrying about commute comfort and keep the 197, maybe treat her to some goodies + trackdays

Big dilemma going round and round my head at the moment! Help!!

 

[Fernandez]

Stop worrying about the commute. I've done 65K in 3 years with lots of motorway miles and personally I don't see any negatives in the Clio as a mile muncher.

 

[deadmau5]

Stop worrying about the commute. I've done 65K in 3 years with lots of motorway miles and personally I don't see any negatives in the Clio as a mile muncher.

Agreed, it's a good mile muncher.

A lot of people think the grass is greener, then when they sell the Clio for something more powerful they realise that power doesn't always equal fun.

I may be alone in this view, but I think the Clio has just enough power to keep it interesting so long as you don't drive exclusively in a straight line. Obviously more power would be nice sometimes though.

 

[Crezzy]

I've been seriously considering swapping mine for something bigger and better.. The truth is I've not found anything that seems to give me that smile when I sit in an take her for a blast. So I've decided to go from a 197.. To a 200 haha. Lower miles so last me another 2 years at that point I can be settled down in my house an still have a relatively reliable car.

 

[chettle]

I think if i was to get rid of the clio, an Integra Type R would be the only option if i was considering a "similar" car.

IMO M3's are awsome cars... running and maintaining one isnt so much fun though

 

[BenW]

Deadmau5, think you hit it on the head with the grass is greener on the other side thing. I test drove the M3 and the power/torque amazed me, that was on my first test drive on straight roads. Second test drive on smaller twistier roads it showed it's weight and size, I then drove my clio down the same road and had infinitely more fun. My friend in the car who isn't really into cars also said the clio felt much more fun!

I think I need to spend some money tidying up the clio, new track rods (needed), repaint the calipers, polish & wax and I'll be happier.

These clios really are great all-rounders and finding the next car really will be a massive struggle

 

[Foxspeed]

I think if i was to get rid of the clio, an Integra Type R would be the only option if i was considering a "similar" car.

think thats the only car that would at the moment make me change hmy:

 

[Fernandez]

If I changed it would have to be for something totally impractical and hardcore like an exige

 

[GrumpyTwig]

I ended up finding cars I'd consider then realising I didn't fit in them, Elise for example.

Newer M3s are too much of a GT car for me, Supra TT would maybe not make a great daily commuter etc. etc.

 

[BenW]

If I changed it would have to be for something totally impractical and hardcore like an exige

An elise/exige is the obvious step up in terms of fun. But, then I can't put my bikes in the back and go to the trails, I don't have a relatively comfortable place to sit on the motorway, they don't have a decent stereo and decent ones are big money!

 

[MikeH]

If I changed it would have to be for something totally impractical and hardcore like an exige

 

[Mentalpen]

Get a 250 cup?

 

[GREGSTERWIZ]

An e46 M3 is hugely quicker than a Clio - anywhere and everywhere. I take your point about how different the cars feel but they are very different cars.

The problem is finding a good M3 - there is lots of rubbish out there and unless you want to spend £13-14k upwards for a well looked after, low mileage car with no issues - personally, I wouldn't bother. Repair bills can be eye watering.

Watch out for SMG actuator problems and cracked boot floors apart from the usual age/ mileage related issues (brakes, clutches, etc. etc). Original spec tyres - conti M3 specific are also £170 a pop.

 

[nicknameless]

What on earth is the point in more power on the road? Absolutely none in my eyes. Maybe some might prefer the power delivered in a different manner but who can actually use an M3 on the road to its potential without being a total and utter dangerous nob? I can't even get close to what the clio's capable of on the road without losing my life or licence. Acknowledging that your left with 4 tailpipes instead of 2 and a BMW badge.

 

[GREGSTERWIZ]

Elise is a good call for the driving experience if a little, erm.... spartan.

Considered a Honda S2000 ? A few more creature comforts, great engine - but needs revving very hard (9200 rpm limit) - and a sublime gearbox (one of the best out there). Handling is not as scary as people make out - I owned 2 x s2000's - they will bite if provoked and you'll need to get used to a powerful RWD car - as with the M3.

Convertible only but GT comes with a hard-top. A little dated now, perhaps, and the dash is a bit Atari on first look, but it provides very, very clear info to the driver (all digital).

No rake/ reach for steering column though so make sure you fit - and avoid 09 cars - there have been many engine failures. Earlier cars are fine but Honda reliability is not as legendary as they make out.

 

[Iain 007]

I think it can be replaced, but not for the same cost level (purchase and running costs)

There aren't many cars this good without big compromise also.

 

[BenW]

Get a 250 cup?

Going by what I read they're not as fun as the 197/200 but are probably better for every day. They're also still a bit expensive, when the prices drop another 2k ish I may well book a test drive. I did however look at R26Rs, the only thing putting me off is the practicality!

An e46 M3 is hugely quicker than a Clio - anywhere and everywhere. I take your point about how different the cars feel but they are very different cars.

The problem is finding a good M3 - there is lots of rubbish out there and unless you want to spend £13-14k upwards for a well looked after, low mileage car with no issues - personally, I wouldn't bother. Repair bills can be eye watering.

Watch out for SMG actuator problems and cracked boot floors apart from the usual age/ mileage related issues (brakes, clutches, etc. etc). Original spec tyres - conti M3 specific are also £170 a pop.

Cheers, no doubt the M3 is a quicker car on the road and on most tracks. But, the 197 with the mods I've done is without doubt more fun than the standard M3. A lot cheaper too.

What on earth is the point in more power on the road? Absolutely none in my eyes. Maybe some might prefer the power delivered in a different manner but who can actually use an M3 on the road to its potential without being a total and utter dangerous nob? I can't even get close to what the clio's capable of on the road without losing my life or licence. Acknowledging that your left with 4 tailpipes instead of 2 and a BMW badge.

The clio has enough power when you're between 5000rpm and the red line but it is nice having the extra power and torque at low revs on something like the M3, actually the low rpm torque was one of the things that most impressed me. But agreed, when you 'on it' the clio has enough power for the road.

Elise is a good call for the driving experience if a little, erm.... spartan.

Considered a Honda S2000 ? A few more creature comforts, great engine - but needs revving very hard (9200 rpm limit) - and a sublime gearbox (one of the best out there). Handling is not as scary as people make out - I owned 2 x s2000's - they will bite if provoked and you'll need to get used to a powerful RWD car - as with the M3.

Convertible only but GT comes with a hard-top. A little dated now, perhaps, and the dash is a bit Atari on first look, but it provides very, very clear info to the driver (all digital).

No rake/ reach for steering column though so make sure you fit - and avoid 09 cars - there have been many engine failures. Earlier cars are fine but Honda reliability is not as legendary as they make out.

Yep, looked at the S2000s and do like them but the dated look puts me off and I would prefer a coupe. Still, might be worth having a go in one.

I think really I'm trying to look for a car that doesn't exist. As much fun as the clio when I want it and comfortable for the day to day commute. The two just don't match and the only real way of getting around it is to have 2 cars which I don't really want to do right now.

Think the plan now is to tidy up the clio, maybe get some track wheels & tyres and enjoy it. I won't go chasing power, seems the only options are cams, supercharged or R26 engine. Cams - expensive for little gain, supercharger is as expensive as the car and R26 engine I think would ruin the N/A nature of the clio.

 

[chettle]

VX220 turbo? Cheap lotus chassis with a vaux turbo cant be a bad combo

 

[Willis]

I think it can be replaced, but not for the same cost level (purchase and running costs)

There aren't many cars this good without big compromise also.

This.

Bang per buck there's not much else out there that'll touch a 197/200. The obvious ones that are probably close to being as good are things like the Civic or Integra Type-R, Focus ST (if you wanted more plushness and less hardcoreness) etc.. But the Clio is the best of that bunch anyway so why downgrade to something from the same class. The M3 is a cracker, looked into the E46 thing myself but insurance was a no-go let alone running-costs. Funnily enough, Impreza's probably aren't much dearer to run or insure that the Clio though...

I've owned both. But obviously you know better.

343 BHP, sub 5 seconds to 60 MPH, 155 MPH limited top speed.

I've got a Clio 200 at the mo. Great handling but not in the same league.

Still, enjoy your fantasy world. Nite nite.

Oooh, handbags!!!

The BMW stated 0-60 of 4.8 is pretty hard to hit though unless you're an actual God. Most people settle with 5.0-5.3 as being about right for them. Top speed, well, whoop-de-doo, what sort of yardstick is that to measure how good a car is or isn't? Vauxhall make cars now that'd pull away from an M3 sat at it's limiter...

 

[The Fonze]

My mate has an e46 m3 and we've been for a few spirited drives and I was all over him in the twisties as the clio just inspires confidence and unless you are on a wide open A road it doesn't really get away on the straights either. Real world performance is very different from facts and figures.